461 Stroker build

Hello,

I've been reading this forum for a little while and would like to get your advice on a project I'm working on. I have a 1971 400 block in a 69 Lemans and I'm interested in putting a 461 Stroker kit in it. This will be a weekend street cruiser.
I have # 96 heads I was planning on using, what kind of compression ratio can I expect from these heads with a overbore of .030
Do you have a recommendation for camshaft, torque converter (400 turbo with 3.55 rear gear) , intake manifold and ignition system?
Also I have three tube headers, are these any good or should I toss them and go for four tube headers tri-y headers or the Ram air restoration manifolds?
Any other recommendations?
I'm on somewhat of a budget so please keep this in mind when answering and keep reliability in mind as well.
Thanks for the help!  

The 96's on a 461 will put you over 10:1 CR, not good for street pump gas. Check out the video I just posted in the "Knights" thread, similar build but based on a 75 455.
Steve  
A little help... 'cause we don't all have to learn the hard way!

Hello

The info I found on the heads is that they are 96cc per Wallace racing and Ken’s machine shop and tuffnuffs cyl head list posted here. The wallace racing calculator says compression will be 9.11 at 462.4 ci, 4.3 gaskt id. Dome -6.6, -.020 deck. It says comp is 9.46 with a 0 deck block. 469 cc with 0 deck block is 9.55

You can go to wallaceracing.com and find a compression calculator there. It's amazingly simple to use.

You need to actually verify what cc your heads actually are though be sure.

9.11 Compression should be ideal more or less. I think 9.5 would be max.

Headers VS RA Manifolds - There is a lot of info on that topic in a recent post titled "header info". It really depends upon what your goals are. The large tube headers provide a noticeable gain in hp over the ra and the ra provide a significant gain over stock. If you want max power use the headers if you are willing to give up some power to more easily access your starter and oil filter etc and unclutter your engine compartment then use the ra. If you use the ra you will need to paint them with eastwood high temp paint and a paint brush or they will rust quickly.

I have never seen the headers you are talking about maybe someone else here has. I would just guess that the hookers are better though.

If you opt for Headers someone recently said hooker super comps fit perfect and others did not.

Camshaft - This depends upon you desired performance level such as drag car, fwy flier or inbetween. Do you want a mild lope or nasty lope? Do you have power brakes and want good vacuum for good low speed function?

Without knowing any of the above I would guess a 274 advertised duration cam with a 110 lobe center like the comp xe274h or similar in lunati. Moderate lope, biggest for use with power brakes without additional vacuum reservoir. Moderate tire burning capabilities with your set up.It will be fast.

Torque converter - Around a 2200 stall. You can have a local tranny shop modify your existing one for less than a new one.

343 gears - nice

Intake - Edwlbrock performer rpm, not the base performer. summit racing $250.00

Carb - I would use a mechanical secondary type but someone here will have to tell you what will work. 650-750 cfm.

Ignition - Many here on a budget get an HEI from a salvage yard then recurve it but the large head interferes wit the firewall on some models. Otherwise get a us made one from summit.  

+1 70Bird, I used Wallace Racing's calculator too but was rushing and didn't enter the gasket and deck height numbers. Just goes to show, it pays to double check your own work!  
A little help... 'cause we don't all have to learn the hard way!

I just got thru building a 461 stroker. Build one you'll love the torque!  Bulter has a nice kit on their web site. My compression is 9.5:1, that is as high as you want with OME heads. I run a COMP Cams XR276HR, it has a nice lope and is very street friendly. I run a Eddy performer RPM intake, with a Holley 670 that been jetted. Its pulling ~475 HP and the torque of this motor is unbelievable, lots of tire smoking fun!  I also ran the 3 tube headers (Hedman PN 28140) for a few months and had no issues with them, I recently bought a set of Hooker 4902-1 and had zero fit issues.  

+1 70 bird on the cam about the same specs at.050 as the 73/74 sd cam. i would try it without the 2200 stall it will hook better on the street.  with 500lbs of torq who needs a stall!

the next cam i buy will be a hyd roller.  
76 455/4spd TRANS AM
69 GRAND PRIX 406/5SPD

Hello

Rowsley has a valid point especially if you do go with the stroker. The reason I mention the stall is because I have installed many 268 and 274 cams and all the cars they were installed in that had stock converters tended to creep forward more than I liked. The 2200 is a very small stall increase and eliminated the problem. It also allows your motor to build a few more rpm before it hooks which is more helpful on a 400 than a 461 engine.

Rowsley – Thanks for the +1 on the cam. Tuffnuff used a similar one as I mentioned earlier on "dawnas build" so my recomendation doesn't make me the only one who uses this type but I appreciate your comment just the same. I know you have lot’s of experience with your hp motor.

1968bird – Is your car an auto?. If so what is the stall on the converter? Also can you please tell        if your Holley is a SQUARE bore [it looks like it is online from the top] and if so how do you put it on an edelbrock spread bore manifold without an adapter if in fact that’s what the eddy really is?  

Its a 4 speed and who said I didn't use an adapter?  

OK, so as I understand it, 70bird asked you a valid, non abrasive question.,. one that might even benefit other readers.
Are you using an adapter.,. yes or no?
What kind, 4 hole or open?

 
When The Flag Drops,,,



The Bull Chit Stops,,,


P. Engineer, Engine Builder

Ok, not understanding what you mean by 4 hole or open,I was not being abrasive! I'm running a Holley 670 street avenger carb on a eddy Performer intake. I'm only running a gasket between the carb and intake.  

I didn't suggest that you were abrasive.,. so I take it that your Eddy intake has enough clearance on the primaries, for them to open with a square bore carb.

 
When The Flag Drops,,,



The Bull Chit Stops,,,


P. Engineer, Engine Builder

Yes, they open completely. I use to run a ~1 inch adapter plate , but due to clearance I removed it and just run a gasket.
Thanks for the clarification.  

I'm running a square pattern Edelbrock 750 on my standard Performer intake, there's only a gasket under it and it seals fine even around the large secondary bore of the manifold. I've seen issues running Holley's on Chevy small block Performer manifolds, the cure was a simple 1/16" plate and a gasket on either side.
Steve  
A little help... 'cause we don't all have to learn the hard way!

The plain Performer Pontiac has had what they call a square/spread bore flange for quite awhile now. No more issues like with the older intakes, either carb works. I used to run an Eddy P4B which was an aluminum version of a stock ponch intake but with a square-bore flange. I believe I have seen old performers that wouldn't allow a Q-Jet.

Anyway heres what they make now- for visual clarity. Edelbrock #2156, for example.

 

Hello 1968fb

I’m interpreting by your brief and incomplete answer to my question that the way my question was posited somehow upset you especially in light of the fact that you actually did run it without a spacer. I apologize if that’s the case. I re-read it and it appears that I could have worded it more carefully to prevent it from possibly being viewed by some as some sort of “slight” etc.

It was merely an innocuous question that I also was curious about myself since I am a holly lover [sorry guys] and haven’t tried to do this myself on the new style eddy manifold etc.

PS - In answer to your question, a 4 hole vs open as tuffnuff is asking refers to the amount of holes in the spacer you used ie. 4 small holes for the throttle plates or just one big one.

Thanks